Correction on my first question, which district do you belong?

Thanks for your thoughts. As far as the response from family and friends I don’t get alot of criticism face to face. The biggest issue that one of my family members has is the traditional rejection of pre-millenialism. However I have pointed out to them that there have been pre-mill Lutherans in the past such as Joseph Seiss who was a Lutheran pastor from Maryland. He wrote a number of books dealing diverse issues. There was also lesser known pre-mill Lutherans such as George Peters.

As far as the Bible version issue goes I too don’t wish to turn this into a Manuscript evidence debate. The only things I will point out regarding your comments is that I have no problem with Luthers Bible being the word of God to the German people. For one reason it was translated primarily from the T.R. (AKA Antiochan Text) just as the A.V. Secondly It was what God wanted the German people to have or as you would say it was soley inspired at that time. I also have no problem when the KJV translators deviated from the T.R. to translate something. The last thing I will point out regarding this issue is to remember that Egypt in the Bible is a type of the world and nothing favorible is spoken of it. This is where the manuscripts ( only 44 in number) from which the modern translations are based (Alexandrian Text). Luther, Olivetan, Reina, A.V. etc are all from Antioch where you have over 5000 manuscripts to witness, and where they were first called Christians (Acts 11:26). But anyway that’s all I have to share on this matter.

What synod are you affiliated with? Do you still adhere to any Baptist Theology or have you adopted Luthern Theology in it’s entirety?

The other thing I really like about Luthern worship and practice is the fact that they don’t just look to preaching as the only way to recieve grace and spiritual growth. As you pointed out in your blog, preaching is fine if you have the right preacher. I believe it can be potentialy dangerous for a young Christian to be soley at the mercy of preaching. I have become convinced that if a person is seeking for truth that the Lord will reveal Himself to them.

I have also noticed that you don’t see the egocentric, arrogant in behaviour Lutheran’s as you see in the Baptist’s. I’m sure you know what I mean when I say this.

Hope to hear from you soon.

David

I too originate from a legalistic, fundamentalist church background and am grateful for some of the things I was raised to believe and for baptizing me. I have tried to have a balanced appreciation for the churches in which I grew up as well as a biblical and cultural critique of their doctrine and practice. I have not always been fair to these groups in what I have said. I don’t always treat them fairly. On some issues I have criticized them wrongly and on some issues I have not been hard enough on them enough.

Your point on the morner’s bench or “old-fashioned altar” is spot on. There are many things that have been made into sacraments, particularly “devotions”. This is a time in which one is encouraged to have an existential experience with God by reading the Bible. Of course, reading the Bible is good to know what God has said and to hear the gospel, but nothing magical happens simply by reading the Bible and I have nearly unequivocally been given this impression by Baptist groups.

I’m glad to see that you aren’t leaving your Baptist experience because you expect your Lutheran experience to be perfect or even close to perfect. It won’t be. However, in terms of theology and worship, confessing Lutherans are much more biblical than Baptists.

I doubt you will find a KJV-only Lutheran church but perhaps I am mistaken.

I have known many King James only Christians in my time. I once had church members calling for me to be fired from a church position because I prepared my sermon from something other than a KJV. I have debated countless hours with KJV-only Christians and find their arguments entirely unconvincing. Also, after studying the history of the Textus Receptus and KJV I became even more solidified in my view that the KJV and is not God’s only inerrant inspired word. As you point out, we do not have the autographs, but neither do we have a word from God that the KJV is the only inspired translation. It seems an arbitrary choice to pick the KJV. Why not Die Luther Bibel? Seems one could argue for it’s sole inspiration just as well as the KJV. I would encourage you to reconsider your interpretation of God’s promise to preserve his word. Most Christians can confidently hold a responsible translation of the Bible and say that God has in fact preserved his word with no worry over claims about “missing verses.” That’s my word on the matter, but I don’t want to get distracted too much with our difference on this issue.

How are your family and friends responding to your transition? It was difficult for some of our family and particularly some of our friends, but the Lord has been gracious to us, and we (for the most part) have maintained Christian fellowship.

Thank you for telling your story and for your conviction to follow the word of God. Perhaps we can continue to dialogue on Lutheran issues. I praise the Lord for his work in you.

-John

Thanks for sharing your story. I too am at a point of converting to Lutheranism, for similar, but also different reasons then yourself. My struggle has been with the the way in which some of the Baptist brethren conduct themselves as Christians and the Legalism involved in becoming a local church member. I personally am a King James Bible believer, as some of the brethren would classify me (King James Only). I find intriging that these “brethren” talk about how Biblical and how the Bible is their absolute final authority, but when you pin them down an regards to how they view the preservation and perfection of the KJV they will say only the “original autographs” were perfect. The problem with that statement is that we don’t have the originals. On top of this debaucle they fail to recognize that God has never cared about originals he promised to preserve His word. (Psalm 12:6-7 Matt 24:35). Remember the ten commandments that were presented to Israel were not the originals, the conversation between Moses and Pharaoh were originally in Egyptian, the Hebrew of this conversation is a translation Exo 34:1-4). For other examples of this see (Jer 36, 51:60-64, Acts 18:28,21:40;22:22). Another inconsistency I find is how a Baptist will make a sacrament out of the Morners bench and dont even realize it. The way of thinking for the most part is if a believer does not come forward after 20 stanzas of “Just as I am” to confess there sins and short comings for the week they are not right with God. The other instance is unless you have been baptized in a Baptist church by a Baptist minister your Baptism (Alien Baptism) is invalid and you must be re- baptized to become a member of the local Baptist church. I know of people who were denied membership into the Baptist assembly that had been Baptized (fully immersed) after profession of faith simply because a non Baptist performed the Baptism. This cannot in any way be justified by the Scriptures. Some of the local assemblies will not allow you to take Communion unless you have been water Baptized. I would not have a problem with this way of thinking if Baptists believed that Baptism and the Lord’s Supper were a means of grace. However, being that they don’t recognize either as Sacraments, why put so many unbiblical benchmarks upon them? I too find great peace and joy in the liturgy and piety of the Lutheran service. I’m not totally on board with Lutheran Theology, but I see an integrity, reverence and great spiritual value within Lutheranism particularly (LCMS) that is lacking in most Baptist congregations. I do see a sanctifying grace to the Lord’s Supper for the believer in Jesus Christ as their Saviour. I still have a problem applying “original sin” to infants and people who are unable to make an informed conscious decision to accept or reject. See Rom 3:20,4:15,5:13, 7:7-10, Ezra 8:1-12,I Kings 14:12-13, II Sam 12:23. However, at the same time I think I understand from going through the Luthern confessions (some in there entirety) that Luther wanted to cover all the bases. May the peace of our lord Jesus Christ be upon you and may you continue to grow in grace.

David

My apologies for taking so long to reply to your comment. I’ll explain further what I mean when I criticize “devotions/quiet time” as a means of grace. In my experience evangelicals have turned Bible-reading into a daily obligation whereby they believe that if they miss a day they are not as blessed or do not enjoy the same level of grace that they would have had they read their Bible that day. The Bible is certainly the voice of God and is certainly powerful, but simply sitting down with it and reading through it won’t do anything of significance. It is the Spirit of God working with the word of God that is effective.

Furthermore, the Bible has not always been as accessible in previous generations as it is in ours due to our technological advancements in printing and distribution. People have not always been able to have their “daily devotions.”

To consider daily Bible-reading a means of grace is a makeshift sacrament. The word of God when believed, obeyed and cherished is certainly a means of grace, but there’s nothing about reading it that communicates grace. Evangelicals who treat the Bible this way have an ex opere operato view of grace similar to the ex opere operato view of the Catholic mass that they would never accept.

From what I know of you, Joel, I do not think that you treat Bible-reading in the typical evangelical fashion. So my criticism of Bible-reading as a sacrament is not aimed at you.

Thank you for encouraging me to think about this further.

Thank you for your kind regards. Most of all, thank you for the great work that you and others are doing over at Wittenberg Hall.

Brian